Speeding on pit road - Can't they make this simpler?

[FS Myron]

There has got to be a way for NASCAR to make determining pit road speed simpler. Why don't you tell us your ideas? We'll pass them on to NASCAR.

[Chris]

Maybe doing something during practice where the cars can get a more exact reading on their tach...
Put the pace car out... let him run 10 laps or something like that... let the cars get out and run so they get a good solid reading.. then not be so strung out like in the pace laps.
I'm sure the cars on the pre-race laps up close to the pace car get a good reading,.. but the further back you are,.. the more of a "guess" it is.

As far as using the tach,.. I think that is fine.  Every time I hear a driver say me made a mistake... he just didn't look down and see what he was running,... when he DOES look down and see, he know he was 200 or 400 rpm over.  SO thats as good as looking at a speedometer

[HUDSON HORNET]

Thrill rides at amusement parks use electro-magnetics to slow down and control the speed of those vehicles. Maybe NASCAR could have a chip in each car that identifies that car and an automated system delivers each car to it's proper pit stall at the pit road speed. That could eliminate pit road incidents, including mishaps with over-the-wall crew members. Have the same system take each car back out to the end of pit road.

A system like that shouldent cost more than several millions bucks for each track, which I'm sure The Brian wouldn't mind raising entry fees and ticket prices to cover.

[Blu]

Im not sure exactly how NASCAR checks pit road speed ,and on track positioning at a given moment (yellow flag) for each car but, IF it reads each individual cars speed via a computer chip, or somehting similar I dont think it would be too hard to send a signal to that car  during pit road entry with maybe a large red light for overspeed on the dash to tell the driver to slow down.



 Kinda like those "slow down" , "your speed is ___" , flashing signs we see along the road that evidently has a radar gun (or something that reads your speed) pointing your  direction. Maybe a flashing "Pit Road speed is___" flashing light to remind drivers?


Even somehting that simple would work on pit road entry. Granted.... it would not work for each individual car,  but even in a pack you would get a reading. its pretty obvious then  if you are going faster than everyone else .


A yellow light could also be used for cautions I would think?

Really doesnt seem all that hard to me.

[FS Ren]

NASCAR uses the scoring loops along pit road read by a computer to determine the speed of the cars.  When a car goes too fast, the computer indicates the car and no questions asked, the team gets a speeding penalty. The drivers get a five mph cushion on the pit road speed to allow them plenty of room for error though. Of course, no racer worth his salt is going to try and keep it at 70 mph when they know that NASCAR won't penalize them until 75.  That's why you see the speeding penalties.

It's easy to figure the car's pit road speed since the teams have the tire circumference, final gear ratio and transmission 2nd gear ratio (if that's what they want to use).  All they have to do then is plug the mph into a spreadsheet and they can see the RPM they're supposed to run.  No trickery from NASCAR about it really.

[HUDSON HORNET]

Might have to station a traffic cop out there on pit road.
Give Mike Helton a badge and a water pistol.

[PlanoHarvickFan]

Excuse me if this sounds stupid, but why not just put a speedometer in the cars?

[Chris]

Excuse me if this sounds stupid, but why not just put a speedometer in the cars?

Well technically they have one already.
The tach serves as the same thing.  KNOWING you have to run (for example) 3500 rpm in 2nd gear is the same info as knowing the speed limit is 55 mph....
THE problem is the drivers get to looking at other cars,.. looking at their pits,.. watching pit crews,.. the trying to "race" other cars on the way out,.. they FORGET to look at the tach and next thing they know they are speeding.  WHen they DO look down and see they are speeding and are running 3700 (instead of the "limit" of 3500) they are already BUSTED.
Tach shows the same thing as a Speedometer,... they just need to LOOK at it.
LOTS going on when they make a pit stop... ESPECIALLY under yellow
Same thing as me or you just tooling down the road not paying any attention and seeing a cop and THEN glancing down to see what speed we are running.... kinda the same principle

[falcon325]

You're spot on Chris. 

It seems to me that, as a simple safety measure, they should install a red light on the dashboard to warn the driver when he's speeding.  Either tie it into NA$CAR's timing and scoring loop, or just let the teams calibrate it to their RPM.  But don't make the drivers look down at their tach while they're dealing with traffic and those very vulnerable pit crewmen.

[Chris]

When I first read this I said "HEY what a GREAT IDEA"...
When the car is over X RPM the red light comes on... have it right on the dash in easy sight of the driver.. so if it flickers on he know he hit it, can ease out of the gas till it goes of... boom problem solved...

Then I thought just a few second more.
Problem
If the Tach is set to trigger a red light when it hits 3500 rpm in 2nd gear,... thats means it's do the same thing in 3rd,... and also in 4th...
SO that means the blasted thing will be on ALL the time when the driver is racing at full speed... LOL
Might get a weeee bit distracting
Good thought though...  might even be workable... but not sure how since it would key off the max RPM and lighting the red light when it hit 3500.... hhuummm
Still a nice idea.

[falcon325]

Problem
If the Tach is set to trigger a red light when it hits 3500 rpm in 2nd gear,... thats means it's do the same thing in 3rd,... and also in 4th...

LOL.  Chris!  Buddy!  We put a man on the moon.  That is a solvable problem. 

Here's a low-tech solution.  Have an on-off switch.  Instead of the crew chief reminding the driver of his pit road tach reading, just tell the dummy it's time to flick the switch.  The annoying part will serve to remind him to cut it off.

[Tyyrus]

Actually Realizing that Nascar Prides it's self of being Low Tech , they could simply install a Detent Switch within the Transmission which would only be activated while in 2nd Gear , which would advise the Driver if he was Speeding (Over 3,500 RPM) by activating the Red Warning Light . But the Ole Boys Club of Nascar , Enjoy Manipulating the Race Outcome , by handing out Pit Road Speeding Violations ! 

[Blu]

You're spot on Chris. 

It seems to me that, as a simple safety measure, they should install a red light on the dashboard to warn the driver when he's speeding.  Either tie it into NA$CAR's timing and scoring loop, or just let the teams calibrate it to their RPM.  But don't make the drivers look down at their tach while they're dealing with traffic and those very vulnerable pit crewmen.

Thats basically what I said!!

When I first read this I said "HEY what a GREAT IDEA"...
When the car is over X RPM the red light comes on... have it right on the dash in easy sight of the driver.. so if it flickers on he know he hit it, can ease out of the gas till it goes of... boom problem solved...

Then I thought just a few second more.
Problem
If the Tach is set to trigger a red light when it hits 3500 rpm in 2nd gear,... thats means it's do the same thing in 3rd,... and also in 4th...
SO that means the blasted thing will be on ALL the time when the driver is racing at full speed... LOL
Might get a weeee bit distracting
Good thought though...  might even be workable... but not sure how since it would key off the max RPM and lighting the red light when it hit 3500.... hhuummm
Still a nice idea.

Actually Realizing that Nascar Prides it's self of being Low Tech , they could simply install a Detent Switch within the Transmission which would only be activated while in 2nd Gear , which would advise the Driver if he was Speeding (Over 3,500 RPM) by activating the Red Warning Light . But the Ole Boys Club of Nascar , Enjoy Manipulating the Race Outcome , by handing out Pit Road Speeding Violations ! 

EXACTLY!! Doesnt seem to tough to ONLY have the light work in 2nd (or whatever) pit road gear they would be in IMHO.

Dont Indy drivers have a heads up display on their visors with a lot of info on it also?? Justa thought there too.

But seriously....a BIG BRIGHT RED light would CERTAINLY grab a drivers attention whether it was set by the car itself at a certian RPM ,OR by a NASCAR grid/ speed gun on the pit road entry lane BEFORE the pit road speed limit comes into effect. THAT would alert them AND give them time to get slowed BEFORE they actually entered the "speed limit zone".

The RED Light in iteslf is not necessarlily a true or exact indicator of speed ( The Tach is)..but, more an attention getter to remind a driver to LOOK at the tach as he is shown to be speeding.And THAT is exact;y whata driver would do IF the RED light came on.
REDLIGHT , A glance at the tach , and an "OOPS, Im going 200 over. I need to slow down" moment, all in a fraction of a second.

Honestly here..this would be much easier, cheaper and low tech then not. Equipmnt is already made, or in place and being utilized that would make this a breeze really. No ned to Rube Goldberg (where you intentionally make somehting simple, more complicated) or,  reinvent the wheel here. IMO its fairly simple, cheap and accurate.solution thats easy to understand by us...I dont know why the guys that make the big $$ cant think of it. Too simple??? Maybe NASCAR would have to approve it?? 

Sometimes some of  these high tech guys overlook the simple things IMHO and overthink  a problem. Ive seen it happen firsthand.
Mr.High School, and School of Hard Knocks and Busted Knuckles Grad. comes up with a much simpler and just as effective low tech solution as Mr. MIT grad's super hight tech, new and improved, 6 month evaluation and trial. idea   

The question Myron posted was "Can't they make this simpler?"...The answer ,whichever way they would choose (and..we've given them a few different options here) would EASILY work without a doubt, AND be VERY effective  is. quite simply....YES!

[FS Ren]

That's all well and good, but what do they do to stop the driver from pushing the 5 mph cushion?  That's why you see drivers getting pit road speeding violations, not NASCAR trying to manipulate the race or the solution being to complicated.  Just racers being racers.   If you tell them that the speed limit on pit road is 55 mph with a  5 mph cushion, then as far as the drivers are concerned, that means that they can go 60.  And they will. And they'll get caught speeding.  That extra 5 mph means that the car's in the pits that much sooner, and it leaves the pits that much sooner.  It's still a race, even in the pits.  It's not a conspiracy, it's a competition. 

Ren

[Blu]

That's an entirely different question Ren.
Make em physically stop speeding?? Im not sure you can honestly...

I would suggest that they  lower the "cushion" to maybe 3 mph (5 mph is too much IMO for any error on a tach for RPM's)over OR, even better yet IMO... do away with it (the cushion) entirely. You're either below, or at the given pit road speed...OR you get the  penalty.... PERIOD! 
As I said with the above question...this  just doesnt seem that hard to me either (to be at or below the speed) and...as an officer of  the law once told me... "It ain't a suggestion"

As you said, WITH a cushion ALL drivers will push to be at THAT cushion limit (or they should be). As you also said,"It's still a race, even in the pits" and , I agree completely.

 A cushion, merely means to me that I have a higher pit road speed allowable.PERIOD!

And, just to clarify...I never suggested there was a conspiracy, or manipulation with this. NASCAR however DOES get the reports though, and does the penalizing so...I'll just leave it at that.

  If you tell them that the speed limit on pit road is 55 mph with a  5 mph cushion, then as far as the drivers are concerned, that means that they can go 60.  And they will. And they'll get caught speeding. 

Ren

Im lost, or just not getting it bud, you'll have to clarify that one for me .
WHY will they get caught speeding???They shouldn't!!..NASCAR told them there was a 5 mph cushion, and that means the allowable pit road speed is up to 60 mph right from NASCAR's mouth! Right??? Im lost here....unless you're saying some will be caught depending on what??  Maybe, if NASCAR determines it is intentional ??

 



LOL, Now THAT is a conspiracy! "We let so and so speed because we didnt feeli it was intentional but, penalized so and so, because we feel he did it on purpose"   Oh boy! Let ME sell beer cans THAT night!!